I hate to say it but

Mirrored assets are boring right now. I’m saying that out of love and need to grab your attention… We see this with the asset’s spread distribution. Don’t get me wrong, I’m grateful for this protocol, but I have access to most first world markets. Most activity are with speculative assets. I know that most of our users are from countries with restricted access, but we are trying to cater to the world. People are here to make money: both big and small. Mirror assets need to be more ambitious than its competitors. We need to exceed the 21st century framework. No ones voting despite high numbers MIR staked because none of the proposals are exciting. The only recent excitement has been implementing v2. Let it be known that I am moderately invested in Mirror and want it to eclipse its competitors.

What we need are more choices, and here are some that excite me and may have been mentioned before:

Leveraged assets: 0.5x , 1.5x, 2.0x,…, etc.
Inverse assets: securities, crypto, commodities
Crypto: ADA, DOT, LINK, good coin, bad coin, all coins

I think they are all relatively easy to implement (ie multiplying oracle data by a certain factor) and by mixing certain attributes we can have very interesting products.

I hope I’m not speaking out of pocket. There’s a long list of proposals passed and have yet to be implemented. Is there congestion in the implementation process? Some of my concerns have been voiced in other places, but it just need to be heard more. What are your thoughts? I’d love to hear them.

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Good thoughts! I slightly disagree with some fo the perspectives, the earning percentages are very very high, but there are protocols out there - suspicious ones - paying 50,000% :), and I will take a “modest” 60% APR over those any day (e.g. the recently sunk IRON TITANIUM, > $1.8bn in assets).

I do agree more choices would be good, some of your suggestions are great!

Give the product some time, let it mature and grow. Yes, it is a competitive space, but also, pushing it ahead of itself may break it.

The most important thing you touched upon, though, is adoption. I am also invested in the project, and the critical metric is number of wallets, number of users. How do we grow that? Make the onboarding and access very easy is one way. Other ways?

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Great points. I was thinking about this the other day - would you guys be down to collab on some blogging or a podcast that was mirror centric? Terra Bites does a pretty good job of introducing and explaining many ideas around the Terra ecosystem - but it would be pretty interesting to do a deep dive into the future of global defi - market efficiencies garnered, the implications of market access, etc. Seems like we have a marketing problem. For what its worth - what brought me to this ecosystem is how well put together it is…yearn (as a leading defi platform) is crushing - the UX/UI is not that great. I’ve been in the space for a while - when Joey K and crew were putting prediction markets together it just felt like a proxy for what projects like this have actualized - we need more eyeballs on the project - marketing might help that. Thoughts on this?

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Also @Hiro I love your comment - I’m new here and I know that a lot of folks have been working hard on this project - but we’ve got to push the envelope. This ecosystem is really special - sometimes its tough to post on these forums for fear of saying something dumb - I know I pause before I hit “Reply” - but let’s get the volume of posts up and encourage others to do the same. This is how we will discover the most appropriate direction. I dig it and appreciate your willingness to toss ideas out there …you too @chudaka_pi . Let’s call out the hard ideas, realizations, questions and work on them. This project is great but I believe that it can be category leading. :fire:

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@still @Hiro Great conversation. I am open to discussing more, getting some Medium posts and other promotion around the project. Been dabbling in crypto since 2015, and in 2018 ended up at the helm of an ICO-funded startup. Incredible 10 months of hard work and spectacular failure, fraud, and drama. Needed to take some time away from crypto as the negative experience spoiled it all for me. Not to mention spending all of my crypto instead of saving it, tens of million of $ worth now. A very humbling lesson. Now, a much healthier approach over the past 12 months. A healthy skepticism for projects that promise the world and try to do everything. chanced upon MIR Protocol by accident almost, the lean and focused framework and active ecosystem attracted me. The 4-year cycle and hard cap on the tokens are a plus. A lot of potential, and the crypto market has a lot of momentum. Having something that works and has a basis of adoption is very important. Competition in DeFi is actually not bad at all! This space is going to expand tremendously, and there will be a place for good projects. Mirror does not have to be the Amazon of it, it does not need to be to be hugely successful. Projects that are all hype, no functionality or, worst of all, have a leadership or top holder team that sabotages the ecosystem, will fail. I think Mirror should stay the course, and we should support it in any way we can.

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Lots of scattered points above but wanted to add that keeping things light, tight, and working is very important. Simplicity is a positive when engineering entire ecosystems. Many projects fail because over-ambitious visionaries at the helm that put engineers and the actual builders fo the platform at impossible challenges. That is what I mean “getting ahead of itself”. Having built AI/ML products and advised multiple startups, I see this every day.

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I could not agree more with you…totally aligned. The market and the community will decide what projects matter and at what level. @chudaka_pi want to brainstorm some ideas for a few posts? I’ll take a few days and pull together a working doc and post it in the forum…if for anything to get more folks excited and pulled in. Hype is poison - but that’s what is so special about this project - like you said, lean and well put together.

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@still I would love to do a podcast to promote Mirror and would like to discuss more with you! Seems like we both want to help MIR in the ways we can. If you can DM me, we could get the ball rolling.

@chudaka_pi That’s amazing you were apart of a startup in this area of tech. I have been circling around and pitching my own ideas, and can see your perspective on progression and its caution. All are important things to consider.

I’m here to network as well, so feel free to DM me with any ideas and let me know what I can do to help. I have some development experience and would love to get a hands on.

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I’d be open to link up on discord or something and have a conversation between y’all. I could an open invite to the forum as well. I think it’ll be a great opportunity and format to vocalize our thoughts.

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Let’s start small - get some momentum and come with ideas to the group. Might be a great way to kickstart. Discord sounds great. I’ll DM as well. @Hiro and @chudaka_pi looking forward to it!

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That sounds great! I think it is good to have visibility here, though. I actually do not know if this is an open forum and whether we can ask anyone - moderators perhaps? - of what the appropriate space for this would be. On the one hand, there is a lot of noise, on the other, this should be open to the whole community and folks should be able to chime in and participate. I think the whole platform is designed with this level of transparency and visibility in mind. Thoughts?

Of course, we should be able to respect people’s privacy, so there are grey areas and some unclear boundaries.

I think if we keep the discussion focused on Mirror here, there is more benefit than risks, everyone can see it. A dedicated Discord channel for Mirror that is open to all interested in the platform would work as well but I do not think I can moderate it.

I see that this Forum and the Telegram group are all public and open Telegram: Contact @mirror_protocol

Thoughts?

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Yes I think this a great idea and would be willing to contribute.

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My thoughts exactly! 100% Yes!

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These forums feel very 2019 and the speed with which ideas can be iterated is limited. Isn’t there a need for a more “topic-based” community where people can come together and chat about which assets to be added, new ideas, pushing the envelope, digital strategy etc?

Is there a reason this is not implemented? Slack used to be used for open source communities and we could just create the chat rooms for the specific subjects. Not sure if Discord is now the way to go and if it does the trick… While there may be few users, having siloed conversations on-topic, for sure myself, I’d be more inclined to be checking daily.

This way, I go when I have a moment about 1x or 2x a week and look at posts. The other issue is that there are so many great ideas but it’s either really difficult (near impossible) to lift them up into more formalized action steps and proposals (and that goes pretty much for any of the areas discussed in the forum / assets, UX, digital strategy etc).

So - voting yes on Discord :slight_smile:

EDIT: I just jumped down before reading the whole thread. Totally resonate with everything said. Let’s get a live chat community going.

exactly we need to move away from meme tech stocks and give actual investors stocks they would want to earn long term (hence increasing capital flight in a crypto bear market)

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I agree. Also mirrored crytos don’t make any advantage, they are avaliable anywhere.
Real wolrd investments like Dow30, Cocacola and similar brands are not easy to invest from many countries and they would atract new traders & long term investors.
Leverage is also a good idea for marketing and better income fees and interest.

I think inverse crypto assets would be a fantastic addition. This would enable Anchor users to deposit UST to earn 20%, then use their aUST as collateral to mint inverse crypto assets, which could then be sold short.

That would enable you to use your aUST to go long crypto whilst maintaining your 20% yield. Anyone have thoughts on this?

In theory, the yields of an inverse mirrored crypto e.g. mBTCx (inverse bitcoin) would be the exact opposite of the current long/short APYs. Not sure if an inverse would be necessary.

You can currently use aUST as collateral to farm short now.

But what if I want to use my aUST to gain long BTC exposure? As I understand it there’s currently no way of doing that in Mirror.

With an inverse BTC, I could use aUST as collateral to mint inverseBTC then sell it short. Giving me my long BTC exposure?

So I get way your saying. If the APY formula for mBTC was the same for an inverse asset, in theory, the APY from minting say mBTCx (inverse) and farming short would be the exact same as minting mBTC and farming long.

You could also buy or borrow mBTC use it as collateral to short farm. Looks like collateral requirement is 250%. With 1 mBTC you could short farm .4 mBTC

I hope this helps and if you have further questions feel free to PM.